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Sexual Misconduct Allegations in The CAF

Fishbone Jones

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No, but when you are running a base, date someone outside the base. Similarly, if you are running the CAF, date someone outside of the CAF/DND. How is this difficult? If you want more dating options, don't get promoted to where you are running things. It's your workplace, not kettle of fish, and there will never not be the potential for a power imbalance when you reach the august heights the GOFOs reach.

Might even help maintain a work/life balance to make friends outside of work.
The person was not in his chain of command. He followed the rules and reported it to both countries. So far as I can gather, no one was worried enough to stop it. Your own personal bias aside, I don't see where he did anything wrong. That's where I'm leaving it.
 

OldSolduer

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No, but when you are running a base, date someone outside the base. Similarly, if you are running the CAF, date someone outside of the CAF/DND. How is this difficult? If you want more dating options, don't get promoted to where you are running things. It's your workplace, not kettle of fish, and there will never not be the potential for a power imbalance when you reach the august heights the GOFOs reach.

Might even help maintain a work/life balance to make friends outside of work.
You can make all kinds of rules, regulations and guidelines you want. Someone will breach them, guaranteed.

SO if what many of you want is no personal relationships between serving personnel, what do you do with all those service couples?
 

KevinB

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The person was not in his chain of command. He followed the rules and reported it to both countries. So far as I can gather, no one was worried enough to stop it. Your own personal bias aside, I don't see where he did anything wrong. That's where I'm leaving it.
Well it does seem some where worried about it = that it elevated to a political mess.
 

daftandbarmy

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Yes, the security implications of supermarket and day-care workers being blackmailed for their indiscretions by foreign adversaries is staggering.

trixie mattel drag GIF
 

Halifax Tar

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Yes, the security implications of supermarket and day-care workers being blackmailed for their indiscretions by foreign adversaries is staggering.

Snr NCMs and Officers... Pour toi

And I think that's the key. If you want to be; are mandated to be; and act as to be superior; be prepared for the expectation that you meet that standard in all aspects.
 

cyber_lass

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Nope, but I guess the way the world today is, you'll have to think about what the media will say about you in 15-20 years using different standards.
Women not liking or wanting unwarranted touching or sexual jokes or sexual advances hasn't changed. Just before it was accepted
(this is the part men are missing). You know how many times at work I was touched and it felt sleazy, but feared for my job as the guys are laughing and I have to "play along", because "it is no big deal"? More times than I can count. But there was never a mechanism that would help me report and not be forced out of my work place. So if you are worried about 15-20 years from now, don't be sleazy? Can't be that hard for people who own penises to learn.
 

OldSolduer

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Women not liking or wanting unwarranted touching or sexual jokes or sexual advances hasn't changed. Just before it was accepted
(this is the part men are missing). You know how many times at work I was touched and it felt sleazy, but feared for my job as the guys are laughing and I have to "play along", because "it is no big deal"? More times than I can count. But there was never a mechanism that would help me report and not be forced out of my work place. So if you are worried about 15-20 years from now, don't be sleazy? Can't be that hard for people who own penises to learn.
Generalizing men is not the solution which you seem to be

Education and repercussions for those who conduct themselves in a manner unbecoming are far more acceptable than casting us off the pier.
 
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Good2Golf

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Do people really think an ultra-feminist scorched-earth all-men-are-scum approach is helpful? My intro to sexual harassment of any kind in the CAF happened during basic training, where a female captain took great delight in insulting every woman in the platoon with the c-word, and occasionally frontally groped male candidates during morning inspections. Complaints fell on deaf ears. That in no way makes any of the confirmed sexualized conduct of males against women (or other males or TG pers) acceptable, but the solution is a concert whole-of-CAF effort moving forward, that ensures comprehensive cultural change across the board, making no exceptions for anyone in a position of responsibility, no matter their gender.
 

daftandbarmy

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Do people really think an ultra-feminist scorched-earth all-men-are-scum approach is helpful? My intro to sexual harassment of any kind in the CAF happened during basic training, where a female captain took great delight in insulting every woman in the platoon with the c-word, and occasionally frontally groped male candidates during morning inspections. Complaints fell on deaf ears. That in no way makes any of the confirmed sexualized conduct of males against women (or other males or TG pers) acceptable, but the solution is a concert whole-of-CAF effort moving forward, that ensures comprehensive cultural change across the board, making no exceptions for anyone in a position of responsibility, no matter their gender.

Dude... there's no statute of limitations on sexual harassment - as we've seen recently.

Just sayin' :)
 

Happy Guy

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I do not think that Cyber Lass meant to infer that all men are guilty. As a female she was expressing her experiences of being tired of all the unwanted touching, leering and sexist remarks directed at her. Given the comments in response to her, I think that she now knows that she could have worded her comments more carefully. Please keep in mind that she is female in an overwhelming male environment. As a male, I have never been a mainly female environment where the attention was focused on me because I was a guy and regarded as a sex object. I think that for the most part, we, males, have never been in such an environment for a long period of time.

Given the comments that I've read so far many of us (males and females) have personally experience some form of sexual misconduct or sexual harassment in some form or another. The number of males, in this forum, who have expressed sexual harassment surprised me as I thought % wise it would be a rather low figure.

Old Solduer and Good2Golf are right, education, self awareness and cultural charge are the key to reduce this serious problem in the CAF. It would help, too, if our Superiors would talk the talk and walk the walk too. If we believe in the Pareto Principle (20% of the population causes all the problems), this minority is wilfully harming DND/CAF. The vast majority of CAF members are decent and respectful people and the general public should be reminded of that.
 

cyber_lass

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Generalizing men is not the solution which you seem to be

Education and repercussions for those who conduct themselves in a manner unbecoming are far more acceptable than casting us off the pier.
The point wasn't to generalise. Just my experience. That should count for something, right? Someone made a comment about being worried about 15-20 years down the road that "behviour" might be wrong. Well my point was this sort of behvaiour was always wrong, it just was accepted and not questioned. That was my only point.
 
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